#jogamp @ irc.freenode.net - 20141006 05:05:54 (UTC)
20141006 05:05:54 -jogamp- Previous @ http://jogamp.org/log/irc/jogamp_20141005050553.html
20141006 05:05:54 -jogamp- This channel is logged @ http://jogamp.org/log/irc/jogamp_20141006050554.html
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20141006 06:34:49 <eclesia> good morning
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20141006 07:29:46 <gouessej> Good morning
20141006 07:30:19 <gouessej> I succeeded in making a RPM without using native (platform dependent) tools: http://stackoverflow.com/questions/26193454/how-to-make-redline-rpm-library-work-with-ant
20141006 07:30:24 <gouessej> :)
20141006 07:31:07 <gouessej> I'll put it into the deployment instructions
20141006 07:37:40 <xranby> eclesia: gouessej: good morning
20141006 07:39:11 <xranby> gouessej: first time i heard of readline rpm
20141006 07:40:47 <gouessej> xranby: Its instructions are a bit incomplete
20141006 07:41:01 <gouessej> xranby: they don't even mention its dependencies
20141006 07:41:29 <gouessej> xranby: Where should I put the instructions exactly? In the wiki? In the user guide?
20141006 07:41:48 <sgothel> good morning early birds :)
20141006 07:41:57 <gouessej> xranby: I try to do something similar for Debian packages with JDeb
20141006 07:42:13 <gouessej> sgothel: Good morning Sven
20141006 07:43:01 <xranby> first i was going to sugegst http://jogamp.org/wiki/index.php/JogAmp_JAR_File_Handling but maybe we need to start a distribution specific page to give hints how to deploy for use on various distributions and app stores
20141006 07:43:15 <xranby> gouessej: i think somewhere on the wiki would be best
20141006 07:43:21 <sgothel> we have the static deployment html file ..
20141006 07:43:48 <sgothel> so maybe we wrap it in a wiki deployment page .. which then also includes those custom/foreign stuff ..
20141006 07:43:57 <sgothel> (so and so unrelated .. however)
20141006 07:44:17 <sgothel> http://jogamp.org/jogl/doc/deployment/JOGL-DEPLOYMENT.html
20141006 07:44:23 <gouessej> I'm not a big fan of centralized "app stores" with tolls but I can spend some time on the instructions of each distro
20141006 07:44:47 <sgothel> you asked for it :) .. I personally, don't care too much ..
20141006 07:45:32 <gouessej> I use RPM and DEB in order to drop Java Webstart
20141006 07:45:47 <sgothel> http://jogamp.org/wiki/index.php/Jogl_Tutorial <- has a deployment item in list ...
20141006 07:45:49 <xranby> my own top priority for the week is how to package one single application so that it can be started as fast as possible on low end embedded hardware
20141006 07:46:09 <xranby> i have tested to use jogamp in combination with robovm
20141006 07:46:28 <sgothel> 'fast as possible' ? <- already inflated then!
20141006 07:46:45 <xranby> robovm is a ahead of time compiler that produces native code
20141006 07:46:52 <gouessej> sgothel: http://jogamp.org/jogl/doc/deployment/JOGL-DEPLOYMENT.html ?
20141006 07:46:53 <xranby> thus all inflated
20141006 07:47:05 <sgothel> and how does robovm handle our JNI ?
20141006 07:47:24 <sgothel> dare to dump an example project via git ?
20141006 07:48:34 <xranby> right now jogamp makes robovm generate an endless loop of support logic: filed a bugreport https://github.com/robovm/robovm/issues/530
20141006 07:48:54 <sgothel> @julien: https://jogamp.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=1042#c1 <- "references to the file format spec/description, or at least spell the names out."; if you are in the mood to produce documentation :)
20141006 07:49:15 <sgothel> so it is not working ?
20141006 07:49:22 <xranby> not currently working
20141006 07:49:30 <sgothel> I thought so .. (JNI stuff)
20141006 07:49:37 <xranby> i have not yet tested the atomic deployment options
20141006 07:50:19 <sgothel> too bad llvm's vm-kit is not yet being picked up .. guess have to do all by our own :)
20141006 07:50:26 <xranby> robovm also uses llvm
20141006 07:50:54 <sgothel> I know .. but GC is bad .. and then .. well, its marketing is quite different :)
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20141006 07:51:39 <sgothel> i.e. a more universal vmkit thingy would be cool
20141006 07:52:05 <sgothel> as I mentioned, gluegen already works w/ vmkit, JOGL only did not due to runtime llvm lib conflicts
20141006 07:52:11 <gouessej> Is "Using JogAmp in Red Hat Package Manager" a good title?
20141006 07:52:44 <sgothel> I would like to see there an entry like 'Foreign Packaging' and put it all in there ..
20141006 07:53:09 <sgothel> so the item list in Tutorial won't get spammed by all those things :)
20141006 07:53:16 <gouessej> "Using JogAmp in foreign Packaging" ?
20141006 07:53:17 <sgothel> ^^ yes
20141006 07:53:36 <sgothel> Just 'Foreign Packaging' would do it .. its all about JogAmp already
20141006 07:53:43 <gouessej> ok
20141006 07:54:31 <sgothel> me fighting w/ OSX 10.9.5 update, which causes regressions .. duh
20141006 07:55:10 <sgothel> nice beautiful race conditions .. and SEGFAULTs .. don't we love it :)
20141006 07:57:27 <sgothel> @Julien: while you edit page, you can change: JogAmp JAR File Handling -> JAR File Handling :)
20141006 07:57:49 <sgothel> Seems like I am better when reviewing than doing :)
20141006 07:58:20 <gouessej> ok
20141006 07:59:10 <gouessej> done
20141006 08:06:33 <gouessej> What do I have to add to show the summary at the top?
20141006 08:07:07 <sgothel> ?
20141006 08:07:42 <sgothel> example pls
20141006 08:08:52 <sgothel> you mean the TOC ?
20141006 08:08:57 <gouessej> In JOGL tutorial
20141006 08:09:19 <gouessej> There is a summary at the top
20141006 08:09:47 <sgothel> The TOC shall be added automatically .. if using structures like '== TOP ==' etc
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20141006 08:11:22 <gouessej> ok
20141006 08:22:56 <xranby> to my knowledge, the fastest bootup from power on to initialized opengl es seen on a raspberry pi is 3s https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Fjfqz6FxC8 this using c++
20141006 08:23:27 <xranby> my goal is to have java and jogamp to bootup under 30s
20141006 08:24:01 <sgothel> avoid JARs then .. use LD_LIBRARY_PATH .. rest is up to the [poor] JVM
20141006 08:24:19 <sgothel> S1 (sleep) might help .. hmm
20141006 08:24:53 <xranby> it usualy takes a jvm using compressed jars to start jogamp and initialize opengl es in 7s
20141006 08:25:13 <sgothel> well .. it should be less :)
20141006 08:25:14 <xranby> thus i am confident that the whole bootup can be sorted under 30s
20141006 08:25:21 <xranby> it should be around 10s
20141006 08:25:29 <sgothel> our jogamp init tests show less .. but then .. JVM init has been done already
20141006 08:25:55 <sgothel> (not on poor platforms .. though)
20141006 08:26:45 <sgothel> AWT headless also helps ofc!
20141006 08:27:18 <xranby> imho, sorting our java deployment options for rapid startup time is crucial especially for embedded user interactive applications
20141006 08:27:37 <sgothel> it all depends
20141006 08:28:00 <xranby> java2d has to go out the door because initializing a jframe takes way too much time
20141006 08:28:09 <sgothel> yup
20141006 08:28:46 <sgothel> usually .. SoC devices .. use sleep/resume instead of cold boot, the latter often takes many seconds
20141006 08:32:25 <xranby> sgothel: out users sends back the device if it boots too slow :/ because they think its broken
20141006 08:32:47 <sgothel> splash screen works wonders sometimes :)
20141006 08:33:45 <xranby> this time i will do the right thing and make it opengl es from ground up
20141006 08:33:46 <sgothel> but yeah, if cold boot up until starting java can be acceptable fast enough ..
20141006 08:36:22 <xranby> JNLP also has to go out the doot for deployment, the latest security checks in the classloader kills startup time
20141006 08:36:49 <xranby> thus unpacked class files is the way to go
20141006 08:36:50 <sgothel> the obvious if '(10:24:01 AM) sgothel: avoid JARs then .. use LD_LIBRARY_PATH .. rest is up to the [poor] JVM '
20141006 08:41:31 <xranby> and obvious, research all java class to native code options gcj, avian and robovm
20141006 08:42:14 <sgothel> I doubt that would save a lot, or better: guarantee savings here (ahead of time)
20141006 08:42:50 <sgothel> what could be dramatic IMHO .. is to freeze an already running JVM state (hotspot, JIT ..) .. and relaunch such
20141006 08:43:00 <sgothel> so .. sleep/resume would help here as well
20141006 08:45:16 <xranby> yes Class Data Sharing found in the hotspot client vm + serial garbage collector may help: http://openjdk.java.net/groups/hotspot/docs/RuntimeOverview.html#Class%20Data%20Sharing|outline but unfortunally this option is not available for use by free software jvm on arm
20141006 08:46:18 <sgothel> if sleep/resume works on a running App on the SoC .. it's all free
20141006 08:46:31 <xranby> like system hibrinate
20141006 08:46:34 <xranby> hmm.. sure
20141006 08:49:19 <gouessej> nowiki isn't very good to show XML code
20141006 08:49:21 <gouessej> :s
20141006 09:03:50 <gouessej> https://jogamp.org/wiki/index.php/Foreign_Packaging
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20141006 21:18:05 <sgothel> https://about.gitlab.com/gitlab-ce-features/ <- impressive feature list, impl. w/ Ruby .. hmm - anybody here tried a local installation yet ?
20141006 21:18:50 <sgothel> (yes .. also a bit scary .. the 'all-in-one' mother of all .. thingy :)
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20141006 21:27:06 <sgothel> https://wiki.debian.org/Groupware <- was checking for cal/dav .. glanced over DAViCal (hosted at gitlab.com in NL)
20141006 21:33:45 <sgothel> http://www.scalableogo.org/ <- looks nice .. hmm
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20141007 05:05:54 -jogamp- Continue @ http://jogamp.org/log/irc/jogamp_20141007050554.html